Wednesday, July 25, 2012

Terms and Conditions Tear Your Ads Apart

In something of a detour from my recent barrage of posts in which I have fun tearing Fifty Shades of Grey a new one, I'm writing a post about Youth Defence. I previously wrote about them and their offensive, obnoxious billboard campaign on Beaut.ie, a post which inspired my friend, V For Vendetta, to do a bit of sleuthing and inform me of a discovery he had made.


The girl in their billboards whose life is supposedly being "torn apart" is from iStockphoto, which you might say is all well and good, until you have a look at their terms and conditions. Namely, their Content License Agreement and the list of prohibited uses.

One of which is as follows:

use or display any Content that features a model or person in a manner (a) that would lead a reasonable person to think that such person uses or personally endorses any business, product, service, cause, association or other endeavour; or (b) except where accompanied by a statement that indicates that the Content is being used for illustrative purposes only and any person depicted in the Content is a model, that depicts such person in a potentially sensitive subject matter, including, but not limited to mental and physical health issues, social issues, sexual or implied sexual activity or preferences, substance abuse, crime, physical or mental abuse or ailments, or any other subject matter that would be reasonably likely to be offensive or unflattering to any person reflected in the Content, unless the Content itself clearly and undisputedly reflects the model or person in such potentially sensitive subject matter in which case the Content may be used or displayed in a manner that portrays the model or person in the same context and to the same degree depicted in the Content itself

I don't know about you, but I certainly don't see a disclaimer anywhere on that billboard.

So V For Vendetta contacted the photographer to let him know that his work was being used in a way that violated iStockphoto's terms and conditions, as well as the rights of his model. The photographer replied, thanking him and agreed that his work should not be used in this manner, also saying that he would get in touch with iStockphoto to see what they could do about the situation.

This news in turn inspired the Bear and I to get all Jessica Fletcher on the other two ads being paraded around the city. So here's what we found.


Well hello you! Yet another iStock image, also violating the site's terms and conditions. There was no contact information for the photographer in this case, so I contacted iStock directly to let them know and got this reply:

Thank you for contacting us.

Please know that we take the rights of our contributors and their models very seriously. We are aware of this situation and are currently working on it. We sincerely appreciate you taking the time to send this our way.


It was signed off by a woman from a department called "Compliance Enforcement", which I LOVE the sound of. In my head she goes around kicking doors down and shouting "COMPLY OR DIE, BITCHES!" at nefarious types. Anyway, this leaves the third and final ad. And guess what? We found that photo too!


In this case, the photo in question is the work of an award-winning Swedish photographer and scientist called Lennart Nilsson. Here's an interesting fact about his work that appears on his Wikipedia page:

Although claiming to show the living fetus, Nilsson actually photographed aborted material obtained from women who terminated their pregnancies under Swedish law. Working with dead embryos allowed Nilsson to experiment with lighting, background and positions, such as placing the thumb into the fetus’ mouth. But the origin of the pictures was rarely mentioned, even by 'pro-life' activists, who in the 1970s appropriated these icons.

It doesn't necessarily mean that the photo above is from a terminated pregnancy, but in fairness, it makes it a pretty strong possibility. We got in touch with the Scandanavian photo agency that handles the rights and sale of Nilsson's work, with a link to the above ad using his photo and here's the reply we got:

Thank you very much for sharing this information with us
I look into this and will contact the company because we have not made this sales.


Shazam, motherfuckers!

Of course, we haven't heard anything since, as it's between the photo agencies and Youth Defence now. At the very least, I imagine that YD are going to get landed with a massive bill for this, and the Nilsson photo in particular, as I somehow doubt that the work of a world famous photographer comes cheap. I know that they're a ridiculously well funded group, what with their connections to big anti-choice entities in the US, but the fact that we might have managed to cost them a chunk of their money while they peddle misinformation and lies makes me very happy indeed.

165 comments :

  1. Excellent sleuthing! Well done you!

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  2. Fantastic work, this is super useful!!

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  3. This is one of the best things I've read in a long time. You are an amazing human being. I'm positively giddy at the prospect of YD being landed with a huge bill.

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  4. You BAMF. I bow to you good sir

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  5. Fantastic, well done on some great work.

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  6. You obviously have little to be at. How is a picture of a girl and two babies with a photoshop tear going through them obnoxious? The mind boggles.

    From a legal perspective you have not done enough research. Its not quite so black and white!I'm a lawyer. I know.

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    Replies
    1. Really? You're a lawyer who missed the fairly obviously stated breach of the terms of use?

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    2. Your research works for me, I'm a photographer, I know.

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    3. I'm a photographer too. Its very easy to quote the terms and conditions you want to quote. we'll see what Youth Defence say. Nobody spends a good few grand on ads and uses photographs without having a LICENCE and I suspect that they have one. Surprised if they don't and our learned friend here will have some egg on their face.

      Delete
    4. Oh Tommy...
      You big eejit.

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    5. Saying "I'm a lawyer" means little unless you specialize in copyright law. As an illustrator I very aware of the legal side of copyright law in several territories and their research is spot on. They've used others people creative work outside of the scope of the license agreement they signed [unless they just ripped the images in which case they are in a heap more trouble] and the third image they did not get the correct license agreement or any it appears as the copyright holder has stated they didn't sell the rights to them.

      Delete
    6. A lawyer AND a photographer! You are a man of many talents Tommy. For the record just owning a camera or taking photos on your phone does not make you a commercial photographer who deals with copyright.

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    7. I get the feeling that if someone came along, claimed to be Superman and gave a reason why the bloggers case holds water, our mate Tommy here will come along say "Well, I'm also Superman and. . .blah blah blah"

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    8. A lawyer(Solicitor) who works in IP and a Photographer. Shall I post my CV for you? Stick to the main issue here.

      Nancy Drew would be my sentiments exactly. Amateurish, but it works if you read what you want to read.

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    9. So you as someone who claims to work with Intellectual properties sees no issue with the copyright holder of an Intellectual property stating they have not sold the rights to YD as per the 3rd image. Nor do you have issue with the first two under the clear license agreement which you can read in full on the iStock website? I would like to see a CV so I can make sure never to hire you. I actually work for the largest tv production company in the UK and there's a whole heap of IP lawyers in the office right next door to me and they don't seem to agree with you Tommy.

      Delete
    10. Let's be havin' a gander at the CV then...since you're so keen on validation of arguments and sources....

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    11. Post your linkedin tommy

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    12. Yeah Tommy, give us all your details. Since you're using an account which was obviously just opened for the sake of having this argument, surely you won't mind us verifying your real-life credentials, such as they might be.

      Instead, use some lawyer words, in context. You know, like habeas corpus, prima facie and so on. Then take some lovely pictures of a bluebird, and have them convey schizophrenic solemnity. That might help in lieu of your obviously-imaginary qualifications.

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    13. No reply? Tommy must be out taking photos, or doing some lawyering, or both.
      He's like Lionel Hutz - attorney at law... and shoe repairs!

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    14. I know Tommy. He sorted out a patent infringement case for me, and photographed my sister's wedding. Just in case you have any other criticisms of these ads, be aware he's also a gynaecologist, a paediatrician, an advertising executive and a graphic designer. So you can basically trust whatever he says on this subject.

      Delete
    15. I get it regularly so im not so wound up at things I read on the net.... Jokin you are all fabulous xxx sales assistant/ teacher/ carer/ hand model

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    16. I see the jury has made its decision already.YD deserve a right of reply to see if there is anything behind this blog. I have no associations with YD whatsoever.

      Sarcastic comments with little weight behind them is all I'm seeing here.

      There was nothing untoward with what I said but some people can't stand to listen to an opposing voice. childish behaviour.

      An Anonymous blogger looking for my details....that's rich. Amazing!

      Delete
    17. Tommy my dear, people have just pointed out that you're a mindless troll and happily stroll away from the subject and a massive hole in your pitiful defense of YD.
      I'll bet money that the profile got created by a YD supporter to spreed FUD.

      Delete
    18. The difference is, Tommy (or is that Tommy Esquire?), that none of us is claiming to have qualifications linked to a real-life identity which make us qualified to comment. For me personally, this is just about making you look silly.

      The really funny thing is that I don't need any qualifications to do that. You, however, seem to have several; the result of which seems to be that you look silly.

      You realise that you are completely anonymous too, right? Physician, heal thyself. I'm assuming that you also have your MD.

      Delete
  7. Brilliant - well done, all!

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  8. Whoop! Great work :)

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  9. Wahey! But wait. If you find the model, and she objects, you could get the campagins taken down! They've effecvitely used her face without her permission, by evading the licensing rules. I'm fairly sure they would have to take it down if she objected.

    Find her, Jessica!

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  10. This has made my day :) Thank you!!!

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  11. This is AWESOME!!!

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  12. Babies - tear your vagina apart

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  13. You are a treasure.
    Imagine if you used your powers for evil...

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  14. I live in England so we don't really have posters of this type around (thank the FSM) but you did a great job with your Nancy Drew-style sleuthing! I wish every woman who's seen these adverts could know the truth behind the pictures...

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  15. Excellent work; you know, I think they're pushing this so hard because Irish people, especially young people, are sick of their dishonesty and moralising. I wrote a little about this before if people find it useful;

    http://3menmakeatiger.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/bad-science-of-youth-defence-and.html

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    Replies
    1. Hi David, I've been reading your blogs about this for a while and its nice to see someone using facts and logic instead of extremist rightwing catholicism as the basis for their argument, both you and Kitty are legends for countering the lies and misinformation surrounding these billboards :)

      Delete
  16. I suspect they ripped these photos... the tear would have been a quick way to get rid of some of the iStockphoto watermark, especially for the ultrasound picture

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  17. In fact young Irish people embrace their sheer honesty and are sick of the untruths bandied about by others who disagree with Irelands position on Abortion. Ireland is the safest country in the world for mothers and babies. Abortion is murder. Can't be more honest than that!

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    Replies
    1. No, what's murder is trying to buy a few stamps on the first Tuesday of every month in the post office.

      Delete
    2. You can go away now, Photo-Lawyerman.
      And come back to us on your 'Abortion is murder' views when you grow yourself a nice uterus.

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    3. A Lawyer, photographer AND a pro-life campaigner. How you fit it all in to your schedule alongside your internet-trolling obligations is beyond me....

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    4. Babies have fathers too! They have as much say as the "Uterus" Ciara.

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    5. Being safe for mothers and babies has nothing to do with abortion, if abortion were introduced it would have no affect on the care given to mothers that want to go through with a pregnancy. You are misrepresenting what the information means.

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    6. "Ireland is the safest country in the world for mothers and babies"

      Current stats say otherwise.

      "Abortion is murder"

      As a lawyer you should know that murder is a legal term which is defined as an 'unlawful killing'. Since people go to get abortions where abortions are legal then they are in fact, not murder. Boom lawyered!

      "Can't be more honest than that!"

      You really really can, it just doesn't suit your agenda.

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    7. I really don’t get this ‘Ireland is the safest country for mothers and babies’ argument. Well we’re a developed country; of course we have good maternity care. However, if a woman is denied access to abortion services and therefore forced to keep her unwanted child how can you expect this country to be a safe place for that unwanted child? Last month’s report on child deaths was in the news again yesterday. That report found that the majority of children who died from unnatural deaths were known to the HSE but not in State care. It found the HSE had been aware of drug and alcohol abuse continuing in a number of families, yet it closed their files. Our country is not a safe place for unwanted children yet you and Youth Defence insist these children are born against all odds to live a life of agony and poverty.

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    8. I can't help but wonder if 'Tommy' is the same rightwing ultra catholic nutjob who keeps commenting on my Irish Times pieces on secularism and abortion ? I'd put money he is :)

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    9. Killing a baby is never the answer, and can never be justified no matter how many studies you like to quote or arguments you like to use.

      Many look at it differently but the truth cannot be ignored.

      Why are some bloggers just throwing insults? Pointless.pathetic.doesn't win any argument/debate but makes you look pretty stupid.

      A lot of angry people around this blog.

      Delete
    10. "I'm a lawyer. No wait. I'm a photographer. No wait. I'm a firetruck."

      Delete
    11. wheres the CV tommy? we want to seem some qualifications. you can't claim expertise like that and not prove it.

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    12. Never heard of you David Robert but apparently I should have considering the size of your ego.

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    13. Never heard of you tommy.

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    14. You sound the exact same as your moronic and eponymous friend on the Irish Times forums. Coincidence ? Perhaps. In either case, we're still waiting for this CV - or even a full name, for that matter...

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    15. Hey Tommy why are you replying here but ignoring valid points to your earlier posts? Why haven't you posted any of your photography work on your blog - real shame not share your creative output with the world or have you been too busy with all the lawyering?

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    16. Tommy - an IP lawyer, a photographer and anti-abortion! What a lucky coincidence that someone with this extremely specific set of qualifications and sympathies stumbled on this particular blog post to put us all in our place! We should all feel honoured that he's taken time out of his busy solicitor/photographer schedule to tell us young people how we actually feel about these issues!

      Delete
    17. Thanks for all the wonderful comments. Keep them coming. Your all covering yourselves in glory. Which paper did you get an article published in again David Robert? I dont think you mentioned it enough. Congratulations on that again. Must be the pinicle of your career.

      I wouldnt like to give anyone any more information on this site as quite frankly your all a bit messed up going by some of the comments i'm reading. A funny old bunch!

      Amazing how a few posters and ads with a girl and a baby with a simple comment can produce such a backlash. I find it very interesting. And il say it again. I have no association with YD. Just looking in from the outside with my own opinions which I obviously am not allowed have or should have simply because i'm male.

      A baby no matter what circumstances you like to dress it up in never deserves to be terminated/aborted/killed/murdered. Its just not natural and in the basic concepts of right and wrong I think your conscience will help you make the right choice.

      I have a baby girl who is 2 months old and has a problem that many mothers/fathers in other countries would kill simply because she has this. She is amazing and it really hit home how fragile life is and how it is whipped away from some people simply because they are not "normal" in the eyes of society. Wouldnt it be great if everyone was normal!

      This is why I got involved in this debate but its impossible to talk to deaf people. Yes I am for life, as abortion is wrong.

      Delete
    18. "It's just not natural"

      Lawyer who has never heard of the naturalistic fallacy, interesting.

      Delete
    19. Tommy, Tommy, Tommy, we are all really worried for your career as an IP lawyer as you can't seem to grasp the basics of copyright infringement and breaking licensing agreements.

      Yes your allowed have your own opinion but you came in here and stated your opinion was somehow better and carried more weight then others because you were a lawyer. You have not debated anything. When called on your bullshit over your lack of knowledge on copyright law you've avoided the discussion and just gone for the standard strawman argument of "I've a baby waaaaaaaaaaaaaa" People here are not deaf they are interested in these annoying little things called facts.

      O and mocking people for posting under anonymous when your posting from a blank blog account set up only this month is a rich!

      Delete
    20. Ireland has one of the highest rates of murder through domestic violence in the world.
      Ireland has very unstringent sentencing for sexual assault, rape and childhood sexual crime ...
      Ireland has higher child poverty rates than most of Europe.
      Ireland has very low representation within government by women , very little gender equality ... And a large gap between men and women's pay; still.

      As a mother of 3 children, and an independant parent, a survivor of domestic violence, and a holder of 2 degrees, I can tell you that Ireland is not a safe country for women and children. Ireland is not a safe country for babies, and Ireland is not an easy country to have a baby in, nor is it an easy country to raise children in. The reason I am still here raising my children in Ireland is because a) I am Irish and b) I have been caught in a poverty trap, unable to get enough time / money together to even prepare myself for an interview.

      I will also add that Ireland lacks basic support services for children with special needs, that more and more is being cut from this every year; that Ireland gives less and less to education every year, that local libraries cannot open every day.

      I could go on, but why bother ...

      Well done on your sluething, well done Good Lady

      Delete
  18. Nicely done! A couple of my friends have had to have abortions, and I hate to think of how these bullshit, guilt trip ad campaigns must make them feel. There was no 'better answer' for them. To Tommy up there, if you think it's the images themselves that are being referred to as 'obnoxious' then you need to take another look at the ad campaign. If you still don't get it, I'd consider another profession.

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    Replies
    1. See above. I obviously dont get it then!

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  19. ha brilliant :P

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  20. Hahaha this is hilarious, great work Kitty!

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  21. FFS Tommy, Ireland being the 'safest country in the world' has zero to do with abortion. Afghanistan and Niger are the worst places to give birth and they have the same abortion restrictions that we do. If abortion is murder then how come the 4,000 Irish women who travelled to the UK haven't been arrested? Perhaps as a lawyer you should get on that!

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    Replies
    1. Good point! so what Ireland is the 'safest place for pregnancies'?! Its the fact women's lives could be at risk due to a pregnancy, or do we deserve to just die and more than likely have the foetus die along with us? Tommy you're so IGNORANT it makes my blood boil! Go crawl back under the rock from where you came from you sad little man.

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    2. It is you who are ignorant. I wont be crawling anywhere. Im quite a happy little man thanks!

      Delete
  22. very Jessica Fletchery - well done!

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  23. Well done. Well done. Well done.

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  24. Well done Kitty, you big legend you! This is brilliant!

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  25. Fair Play Kitty! I'm so sick of the manner in which the pro choice groups conduct themselves. It's about time they got a bit of a kick

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  26. Best news I've heard all day! Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch.

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  27. Well done. That Tommy guy is certainly doing my swede in though. If your a solicitor god help the unfortunate people who get landed with you. I think I'd rather take my chances in the nick than have a bigot like you (mis)represent me.

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    Replies
    1. Note the lower case in 'god' ;-)

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    2. I love to know how you came to this conclusion. A Bigot??????? I beg your pardon.

      By all accounts you seem to be letting everyone know that you are the Bigot (note the capital letter B)

      Delete
  28. Brilliant work. Absolutely made my day!

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  29. Thanks for this, found out from boards http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056707207

    Big thread on the stunts YD pull

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  30. If I ever meet you I'll be buying you a pint. Nice work.

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  31. Great work and have enjoyed your blog@David R.Grimes.

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  32. Some individuals or companies want to use the photographs which are clicked by some another one then they need to commit agreement with those person which is called photography license agreement.


    License Agreements

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  33. Tommy,

    What about abortions for medical reasons??

    Or is there never a medical reason for an abortion?

    Have you encountered the problem of ectopic pregnancies.. how do you think they should be dealt with?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi Tommy,
      Thanks for replying. I can't actually see where you deal with the problems of ectopic pregnancies above. In case you don't actually know what one is, here's a quick definition from pubmed: An ectopic pregnancy is a pregnancy that occurs outside the womb (uterus). It is a life-threatening condition to the mother. The baby (fetus) cannot survive.

      I understand that you believe that all life is precious, but in cases of ectopic pregnancy it is vital to remember that the life of the mother is precious too.

      Also, Congratulations on the birth of your daughter.

      Delete
  34. Well done to you!!! This is great work and adds yet another layer to the lies being paraded around by this group.

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  35. I hope YD have plenty of KY jelly.

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    Replies
    1. That would be immoral, they give and take it dry the way god intended!

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    2. If this was FB, I would "like" your reply.

      Delete
  36. Thank you, you've just made my day :)

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  37. Right back at you YD- LMAO brilliant work REd Lemonade- and a big thank you.xx

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  38. LADS! Thanks so much for all your comments, I'm amazed the blog hasn't broken at this stage!

    You're all great (with the obvious exception of everyone's favourite lawyer/DJ/photographer/anti-choice advocate) and thanks for reading, I really appreciate it.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks for the mention. I made a few general observations about your blog and look at the reactions. Trial by blog...Scary. You have some lovely followers.

      Must look into the DJing......

      Delete
  39. Absolutely Fab!. Delighted!

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  40. Tommy I went to your Blog but you weren't there!...You haven't filled in your profile, credentials or posted your CV. What's up? Are you busy taking your own photographs to give to YD to use for their next poster campaign?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Your obviously a comedian. Am I right?

      Anonymous looking for my information. As I said.."ironic"

      Delete
  41. Wonderful work. Well done, women and men who have a desire to maintain human rights need people just like you.

    Anyone who is stupid enough to say that Ireland is the safest place in the world for mothers and children is clearly a man (and perhaps a man with too many jobs) who has never had to make difficult decisions about giving birth or not. Ignore people who are too stupid to understand human rights at any level.

    Keep up the great work.

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    Replies
    1. Youve made quite a few assumptions there and thrown in a few insults too. Lovely.

      Sure what would I know?

      Delete
    2. Human rights? So is the baby not human?

      Delete
  42. This is an amazing piece of work and you should be proud! I think its far more Erin Brockovich than Nancy Drew!

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  43. Absolutely genius. Hats off!

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  44. bullshit. go get a job, loser.

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  45. Great work Kitty. I always feel under-qualified to comment on any posts about abortion but I think my feelings on the subject can be summed up by the fact that I've lived in a country where it is legal for three years. However, I've never been forced into getting pregnant then having an abortion. And I'm pretty sure that if I were to get pregnant, I wouldn't be frog-marched to the nearest abortion clinic. Which I *think* is what YD is trying to say would happen if Ireland legalised it.
    On the flip side, although I think that abortion would be the last resort for me, personally and for us, as a couple. It is comforting to know that I would have the support and facilities nearby if this was something we would need to use. And we would have follow-up services should we need them. Instead of being given limited information from a doctor who then turns a blind eye while I fly over to another country to have a medical procedure.
    Oh, and I don't have to deal with this bullshit.
    Sock it to them Kitty.

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  46. oh shut up Tommy, as man you'll never understand what its like to have the horrendous misfortune of being raped and be forced to bear your abuser's child as result, that's a horrendous trauma to go through and don't give us this shite about "its not the foetus' fault it was formed" BS. A woman who was raped didn't want the man to invade her uterus so why should she have to suffer because ignorant people like you shout loudest? You're a lawyer. God help the country, no wonder rapists get F-all punishments when brought to trial. People like you back them up.

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    Replies
    1. Anonymous again.

      So the baby dies because of what the father did? I dont think i'd like to be terminated/killed/aborted if I was that baby. Would you?


      Another insult and silly statement at the end there.

      Your very angry....why?

      Delete
    2. Are you for real?

      You cannot see anything from anybody elses perspective?

      You believe eptopic pregnancies should be allowed go full term!? (which begs the question do you even KNOW what that is!? Google it)
      You think its natural for a person who has been raped and falls pregnant ads a result to be forced to have that baby?

      I cannot believe there are people who simply don't want to give people a choice.
      Nobody is forcing women to have abortions, I'm sure that the agencies ask the women/couples who attend questions etc, and they allow people leave if they decide to go through with the pregnancy.

      You wouldn't like it if my beliefs were forced on you, and I don't appreciate the law upholding your right to force your belief upon me.

      Everybody should be allowed to decide for themselves what is the best thing to be done in their individual case.

      Delete
    3. At what point does a baby have the same right to life we have. Is it only after it is born? Does a baby inside the mother not count as an equal member of the human race?

      Delete
  47. The killing of an unborn child is always wrong. The unborn child has no voice only us.

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    Replies
    1. "Always"are you sure....http://www.terminationformedicalreasons.com

      Delete
    2. I agree but you dont get a great response here if you have views and opinions like this.

      Delete
    3. what you are saying is that the unborn and as yet unformed bundle of cells that form an embryo has more rights than a fully alive woman who is already a functioning member of society?

      And you have the right to tell her what to do?

      Delete
    4. No. The point you arr missing is the neither the mother or the baby has more rights than the other. They have the same right to live. So only in extreme case where one of the too will die, abortion becomes an option for the medical professionals.

      Delete
  48. A regular Jessica Fletcher! :D

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  49. Here in the states, I drive past those two last pictures almost daily. Supported by a huge pro-choice group. Interesting. I hope something comes from this.

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    Replies
    1. Oh - do you think you'd be able to take pictures of these pictures? It would be class if Kitty could put them up and compare them!!

      Delete
  50. Fair play, I absolutely detest those posters and campaigns, the thought of how a woman who has had an abortion must feel when she sees them is deeply upsetting. As for the multi-talented Tommy, your arguments are ridiculous. Unless you're a woman, it is impossible to understand the anguish caused by unwanted or life threatening pregnancies. A woman has the right to decide, you don't have the right to judge her.

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    Replies
    1. Now your hitting the nail on the head. Many women seem to have negative psychological effects after they go through this horrendous proceedure, especially on the anniversary of it every year. But sure Im a man. What would I know.

      A man has as much right to decide on these issues as the woman and every right to offer an opinion on this matter.

      What a very ignorant comment!

      Delete
    2. You do not have the right to decide what happens to a woman's body, regardless of your involvement with her. It is her body and ultimately she should have full control over it. Of course a woman has negative psychological effects after, thus the need for care and understanding after. The entire experience is traumatic, not just the abortion. Carrying an unwanted child and giving birth to one is very traumatic, physically and emotionally. Your insinuation that the act of abortion is the only thing to have negative psychological effects is so wrong and blind.

      Delete
  51. Don't feed the trolls, guys! Unless of course it's Tommy because he's fucking brilliant craic.

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    Replies
    1. Thanks Jessica/Nancy again for the mention. Im quite the comedian obviously. its a pity the issue at hand is so serious.


      Keep up the great investigative work!

      i know for future reference not to question you again.

      Little to be at........

      Delete
  52. Comforting to see a lawyer that can't spell. Remind me never to hire him.

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    Replies
    1. Sorri Cathy. Yes, that's the issue here! great comment!

      Delete
    2. ehrmagerd-girl26 July 2012 at 01:17

      Oh Tommy... If you were also an Actor-Slash-Model as well as a legal mastermind and Magnum photographer, I think I'd have to offer myself to your gods.

      Delete
  53. Wow, Tommy is really, really trolling the hell out of this! its worth reading all the way to the end of the comments.
    And its not a baby, its a foetus, I never regretted my abortion, pity others choose to get upset over it.
    These adverts don't upset or impact me in any way, I will never regret taking care of myself and my family, I'm lucky I got to the UK early, the real damage is the costs involved in traveling making people wait longer.
    Nobody is forcing an abortion on anyone, its a personal decision that has nothing to do with anybody but the adults involved.If youre so pro-life go work with children living in poverty, we have plenty of them.

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  54. Your man is gas he keeps shiting on about the commentators on this blog having 'little to be doing', well buddy you've spent the DAY on this blog, you weirdo. Get off the couch, put on your pants and go away!

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  55. Tommy you are fantastic, pro life supports are all so determined to prevent abortion with no regard to the life it may be potentially destroying.
    Kitty - you are fabulous!

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  56. Just so you know: there is no God.

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  57. *Reads posts since yesterday.*

    *Rolls around laughing*

    BRING BACK TOMMY! :P

    He's a fuckin' FIRETRUCK!

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  58. I bet Tommy can do a great Blue Steel as well.

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  59. I had an ectopic pregnancy I had to end, then when I was diagnosed with lymphoma and was just 4 weeks pregnant, had to terminate so I could get treatment. Yes, it broke my heart since I always wanted children, but there were no other options.
    So, Tommy--do not jack around like the man can make the decision. I am sick and tired of men and old ladies well beyond their child-bearing years trying to say what goes on in my uterus.
    My husband and I agreed it had to be done. We discussed it. But ultimately, I had to be the one to go through either decision. Luckily I am married to a wonderful, supportive man. If I were married to a fecker like you, I am sure I would have lost my battle with cancer and the poor baby would be getting brainwashed by the likes of you.

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    Replies
    1. I think if your story doesn't prove to tommy how wrong he is, then he is a lost cause. I respect his right to his opinion,but what you have been through just shows how the need for choice is so important.

      Wishing you all the best & hope you are doing well now

      Delete
    2. Anon - Thanks for your comment and for sharing your story. I hope things are going well for you now.

      Delete
    3. We (my husband and I) are great and are in the process of starting our family by other means.
      And, yes, I had medical reasons, but it is a matter of choice no matter what the scenario.
      Thanks, all.

      Delete
  60. @Tommy - I'm a world famous photographer/pizza chef/horticulturist. I'm doing a series for my new gallery/pizza parlor/greenhouse based on the lives of photographers/IP Lawyers/Pro-Life people. Would you be able to send me a head shot/CV/Banana pants? That'd be just great.

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  61. Thank you for your amazing work! Can't believe they used Lennart Nilsson's photos! The man uses aborted foetuses for his pictures. And now they are most likely going to have to pay (big money) for the picture they used = money spent on supporting a man who supports abortions. Oh the irony is golden!! THis all put a big smile on my face! And Tommy only added to the fun! Keep feeding the troll - I wanna see him jump!

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  62. @Tommy, no I am not a comedian. I am the European Sales Manager for a Multinational Company, and I am a woman and I am a mother of 3 and I have had an abortion but that aside.... I did not claim to be something that quite obviously I am not i.e. a Lawyer, (IP at that, rather convenient), a Photographer and most probably last but not least a father to a daughter that has a problems that many mothers/fathers in other countries would kill simply because she has this. Would you care to elaborate on that and classify what this problem is. Who are you to judge parents if they decide to terminate a pregnancy. How dare you. You speak about the father having rights just as the owner of the "Uterus" has, again how dare you. Most terminations happen because both man and woman decide that this is the right decision for them at a given time or for a given reason. Some people are faced with impossible decisions to make and they do not make them lightly, unlike your comments. Of course life is precious, so is mental health. There is no black and white in any situation and in particular for the majority of people who face this sad time in their lives it is undoubtedly one of the hardest decisions they will ever make and again how dare you judge. I am anonymous exactly because of people like you. I could have posted myself as Kate / Phillipa / Camilla / Mary / Charlie / Henry etc etc. You call abortion murder, there are only certain types of people who do that, you are one of them. You are entitled to your opinion without doubt, but do not lie about yourself when you quote it. I have 3 children. I also have a niece with Down Syndrome who makes everyones life a joy. Do not use her illness (albeit hooded as all your comments are to push your anti abortion BS) Now Tommy, FO and get a life! Or Tommy, man up and show us who you really are.

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  63. Oh and Tommy, me again Anonymous (AKA the lady above).....You're a TOOL!

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  64. thanks for sharing.

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  65. Kazaam! I am so so happy and appreciative that you took the initiative to look into that narrow minded, pathetic campaign... Thank you for the time you took and the (satisfyingly ironic) results you gleaned!

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  66. I can't decide which I love more! This fantastic article or Tommys ridiculous stupidity! Great read from top to bottom! :)

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  67. I started reading this blog for the 50 Shades diatribes and ended up stumbling across this...
    Seeing as I live in England, I've grown up with abortion being an available (but fortunately not needed) option so that probably influences my views on the subject but I have a really hard time understanding how anyone can maintain an anti-choice stance.
    I accept that it's everyone's right to believe whichever side of the argument that they choose (although it does piss me right off when people put their opionion across as "truth" - no you twat, it's your opinion...) but I don't see how "right to life" always trumps "right to qualitiy of life".
    I believe that the most fundamental right any child has is to be wanted. A woman being forced to have a child she doesn't want isn't going to do either of them any favours and I find it really hard to understand how anyone could think that someone living an utterly miserable life is preferable to never having existed in the first place.
    Oh well, it's not like it's really the kind of subject where anyone's ever going to change the other side's minds so this is probably the most pointless post ever but nevermind eh...
    p.s. Good sleuthing!!

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  68. I have every sympathy in the world for a woman or couple that feels they have to have an abortion. It is not her fault that this service is there and society has made it "normal" for a woman to have an abortion. I equally have the same sympathy for the loss of the baby's life which is just as tragic. I'm in no way whatsoever judging any woman who thinks that this is the right option. This seems to be the consensus a lot of people on this blog have come to. Funny how it is people on this blog that are judging when you analyse it!

    I understand entirely that pro choice people have been touched by life in different ways that have led them to take this stance and that is just the way things are and sadly the way the world is.

    I have my opinions based on my own experiences and other people have their opinions based on theirs. I keep coming back to the point that a life is ended. In my opinion that is the fundamental point. Every life is precious! We strike a nice balance in Ireland at the moment and there is no need to introduce any laws permitting abortion. Research has come along way since abortion was introduced in various countries around the world and people are beginning to realise that a baby is not just a bunch of cells. I saw my daughter moving her arms and legs at 12wks. Some babies lives are destroyed at this stage or earlier/later. It pains me to imagine this.

    I'm glad I contributed here because if a distraught woman contemplating an abortion stumbles across this blog, at least she'll have some sense of both sides of the argument and might think twice.

    Abortion should never have been introduced. I say that abortion is murder because I class an unborn baby as an equal human being to me or you and killing that person is an unlawful killing which is murder. Compare it to the death penalty. Is it murder when someone is executed on death row? I would say yes. Is it murder when a doctor kills an unborn baby? Yes. It is murder when a human being kills another human being. Kill/murder, I make no distinction. Do people really really think about what happens during an abortion(How it's carried out) and how it might fix one problem for it to start many many more?

    @Anonymous - I'm not using your niece for anything so your barking up the wrong tree there. I won't be giving you any information! You are also quite vulgar and abusive which doesn't help your argument, only weakens it. Truly sorry to hear what you have gone through. Likewise to some of the others above. I can imagine how tough it was.

    I won't be visiting this blog again you'll all be glad to know. I never contributed to a blog before so I most definitely am not a "Troll". It's been a most positive experience but back to the day job. (queue sarcastic comments again) By the way I have been completely honest on this blog. I'm honestly shocked at the abuse I received here. I say again I have no association with YD and never heard of David Robert Grimes but for some unknown reason, think that I should have.(I'll keep an eye on the Irish Times from now on) I made fair comments which I am entitled to make but boy, some people just don't like being questioned.

    My sincere sympathy to any person that has had to deal with any aspect of abortion. There are never any winners, only losers when it comes to abortion.

    Til we meet again, God bless.

    PS. I did like the Lionel Hutz type comments and before you ask.. yes, you can also use my business card as a sponge if you wet it!!! You've given me some ideas. I think there's an appetite for a law firm that specialises in IP Law, photography, djing, fire truck driving lessons and Human Rights Law...keep an eye out!!!

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  69. I am fairly confident the twit will at least lurk.

    So, nothing to say about my situation that was literally life or death for me? Of course not.

    Also, scumbag, I teach special needs kids of all types. Clearly they aren't all being aborted.

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  70. Quote from 'Tommy Esq' - "I'm glad I contributed here because if a distraught woman contemplating an abortion stumbles across this blog, at least she'll have some sense of both sides of the argument and might think twice."

    Really Tommy? You really think a woman gives that little thought or consideration when deciding on an abortion, that your comments here might give her a side she never considered? Thats one thing (of many) that really annoys me about pro-life campaigns, it treats women like they are so stupid and 'selfish' that they dont actually themselves THINK or consider anything else before having an abortion.

    This YD campaign is really annoying me too as it is using faux concern for the woman's mental health as a reason to have these upsetting billboards plastered around the place.

    When there's actually no evidence (yes, that pesky thing) that women of normal mental health status have long term mental health effects after an abortion - women that do have long term issues that last more than a few months are usually those who were already depressed/suicidal etc. I suppose Tommy's probably a psychologist in his spare time so would know the research I'm talking about.

    YD are not actually concerned about the woman at all (or the child for that matter). They're only concerned that women don't have the abortion, and after that, YD will forget all about these women and won't be there to support them through their unwanted or dangerous pregnancy, or when they have the child they can't afford, didn't want and now need to support.

    Well done Kitty, even if it turns out they did purchase the images, just the fact they are put to inconvenience now gladdens me a lot. This is EPIC!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "You really think a woman gives that little thought or consideration when deciding on an abortion, that your comments here might give her a side she never considered?"

      THIS THIS THIS.

      The actual idea that ANY woman would be like "Hmm, unexpected pregnancy, I don't know what to do. Rather than calling a crisis center or talking to my family or friends or partner or trusting my own judgement and thinking long and hard before making a decision, I'm going to take the advice of RANDOM DUDE ON THE INTERNET" is just so insulting that I don't even know where to begin.

      Delete
  71. The fundamental question here is at what point does a baby have the same human rights as everyone else. The right to life that an unborn human has should start when that little person starts to display signs of life such as respiration and movement. Once its heart is beating there is no choice to terminate as the mother only has choice to do what she wants with her body and the baby inside her isnt her body. Of course if the mother is at medical risk then the procedure can be used as last resort to save her life. If the mother and father had sex (even with protection) there was a chance of pregnancy and if people want to have sex then they should only do so if they are responsible for the possible outcome. In the case of rape which is a terrible thing.. Unfortunatly the rape happened and cant be undone but as I said this baby is human and should be protected. If a woman is raped there is the morning after pill. After that window its out of our hands.

    All the pro life vs pro choice stuff is great fuel for media and debate but the only question that needs to be answered by us all is when is a baby human. When does it count as a person. When it is born? What about the day before it is born? What about the week before that? Or weeks before that? All the way back to when its heart started? What about the day before that?

    My opinion is that once there is something there that can be aborted, then it is too late for abortion. The new person has formed.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If the mother honestly feels she couldn't handle the pregnancy would you work to ensure that the unborn child could and would be transferred into another woman who could love and raise the child as her own? If not what would you do when women tried to terminate their pregnancies themselves? Even if the child survived to term what would you suggest should be done for the child once they're born? Would you suggest that they be subjected to the pain of living in a home where they aren't wanted? Or sent to an adoption center which is already over crowded?

      Please work towards finding answers to these questions and helping improve the quality of living for children in poverty and children who are waiting to be adopted.

      Delete
    2. I have to agree it is more important to think about finding safe loving homes for these kids. I work with children and i have seen foster parents who have given wonderful lives to children and i have seen bad ones who neglect and destroy the lives of these children. The important thing to do is to figure out a better way to give every child the chance to grow up happy and safe.

      Delete
  72. Brilliant post, Kitty. I love when organizations like YD are shown up for what they really are - an inconsiderate shower who care more about quick shock tactics than the issue they're trying to highlight.

    On the abortion issue, I don't think it's right, so I'm not going to have one. Simples. I've no right to tell another woman what to do with her body. Nor does anyone else. There are too many goddamn preachers riding round on their high horses who will never even have to deal with a pregnancy and have NO idea how they would feel in the situation.

    Fuck off and do some work, Tommy. It's highly unprofessional for a supposed Lawyer-cum-Photographer to engage in arguments that "supposedly" don't concern him, so toddle off and take a few photographs or do a bit of work for your (unfortunate) clients.

    Sincerely, Sharon. (Expert on Nail Polish Names, The Works of R.L Stine, Horror Films, Mills & Boon, and Household Budgeting).

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  73. There are some ridiculous anti-abortion comments here... I myself would never have an abortion unless there was a medical reason that meant I had to. That's just my personal choice, I can't see myself ever choosing to have one. BUT I am completely pro-choice. I respect the choices of other women. These pro-lifers do not. With them it's "I hate abortion and so none of you should be allowed to have one." It's a disgusting attitude.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. But if it was in the case of a medical reason you wouuldnt actually have a choice. It would be the only way to save your life. The "choice" should be in the hands of medical proffesionls who understand that life is to be proteccted. Otherwise the irresponsible women out there will be choosing to end a life because they are not finantially ready or other selfish resons.

      Nobody should have that choice. If a woman can choose what to do with the body, can she kill herself?? Of course not cos if she is scuicidal she is probaby not in full mental health so she should be protected from the "choice" that makes sence to her.

      I dont care about abortion. I really dont. The only thing i care about is the life that most people here seem to think is disposable.

      Delete
    2. While your entitled to opinion, please don't assume that women who chose to have an abortion haven't thought about why they should and shouldn't do it.

      Delete
    3. Im sure its not a decission that is reached lightly but its killing a person. Which is morally wrong.

      Delete
  74. I think it's pretty awesome that you guys reported that. If I were one of the photographers, I'd be really grateful (especially in the case of the identifiable girl!) and I'm sure she would be too.

    Well played!

    Also, does anyone remember that Friends episode with Joey and the posters for VD?

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  75. Good enough for the self-righteous f***ers,i hope they get all they deserve,they make my blood boil when they descend on my local town like a plague of locusts invading everyone's privacy,peddling their shite.i have complained to gardai about their graphic posters of actual abortions but apparently they're not breaking any law.I invariably get into discussions with them but they're just too small minded for intelligent debate.

    love you blogs by the way,my friend posted this article on Facebook,this led me here to 50 shades of side splitting hilarity,many thanks

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  76. I find it inspiring that you took the time to do a bit a research rather than take what you are seeing at face value. I'm glad that you were able to let the photographers know about this.

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  77. Thanks for sharing...

    here is one of the good Online Food Deals site in india: Online Deals in Delhi at Khaugalideals.com

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  78. waw very nice i hope they get all they deserve

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